EPISODE 226 WITH RICK YVANOVICH: EMBRACING CHANGE AND DEFINING YOUR PATH

Ready Yet?! Podcast Episode 226 with Rick Yvanovich: Embracing Change and Defining Your Path 

Transcribed with Descript

Erin Marcus: Hi, I’m Erin Marcus, former corporate executive turned entrepreneur and founder and CEO of Conquer Your Business. Welcome to the Ready yet podcast. We’re excited to bring you more than 100 episodes of interviews and insights designed to help entrepreneurs get the financial and emotional freedom they need in order to build a business and a life they’re proud of.

Erin Marcus: Welcome, welcome to this episode of the Ready Yet podcast. I’m excited for today’s guest, Rick Yvanovich. We have been talking about Business is Unusual, which is the name of your book, which I love because I think as I get older, you can tell me, I think this is a passage of time thing, what we think is.

Erin Marcus: change that we think is unusual. Yeah, it’s different than it was before, but what do they say? The only constant change is change. You can decide if it’s good, you can decide if it’s bad, but it doesn’t ever really go away. So I can’t wait to have this conversation and hear about your take on all of this.

Erin Marcus: So before we dive into that, why don’t you give people a little more formal introduction to who you are and what it is that you do?

Rick Yvanovich: Thanks for having me Aaron, and thanks for that quick intro. Now, before I Dive into and actually answer the question. You just asked. I’m I’d like to quickly share a core belief that I have And it’s that we all have the potential each and every one of us to be architects of change.

Rick Yvanovich: In this era that we’re in at the moment, this time we’re in, it’s, it’s really defined by constant and sort of never ending transformation. And our task is not just to keep up and sort of keep our head above water, it’s, it’s more than that, but we have to actively shape the path forward. So, Maybe we’ll cover it today, but, you know, when we look at me and my past, I started off stacking shelves in a supermarket and learning the ropes of, of people management.

Rick Yvanovich: And then I moved into the more precise world. Of accounting. Yes, I am an accountant

Erin Marcus: You’re still friendly and happy where do you you’re good we’re good i’m a background Services with a lot of attributes and things. You’re golden. You’re fine

Rick Yvanovich: Yeah, yeah, that’s good and not to negatively or positively stereotype accountants, I was in a podcast recently it says Rick, you’re not an accountant.

Rick Yvanovich: You’ve got a character.

Erin Marcus: And I know some very friendly, very extroverted accountants. So I think that, I think that stereotype has changed a little bit.

Rick Yvanovich: Anyway, accounting is great. Anyway, so I moved into the more precise world of accounting myself and then later navigated the more constantly evolving landscapes of tech.

Rick Yvanovich: and humans. So my story itself demonstrates the power of transformation and continuous learning and the significant impact that each and every one of us can make. I believe that our actions every single day. It doesn’t matter if they’re big or they’re small They do shape our future and as we discuss stuff today Aaron I want everyone listening to remember this You are your brand and every single decision Every choice that you make is part of the unique story that you’re crafting for yourself.

Rick Yvanovich: How you react, how you adapt, and how you innovate in the face of all of this change, and chaos if you want, of what’s going on around us, will define your story, and more importantly, your legacy. So this belief inspiring each of us to aim for consistently higher achievement is the cornerstone of my work, my life purpose.

Rick Yvanovich: So as we dive into our conversation today, let’s not just think about adapting to change. But about how we can define it. After all, when we embrace our unique qualities and strive for personal growth, we are not just participants, but catalysts in our ever changing, business as unusual world. So let’s get into this, Erin.

Erin Marcus: All right. The thing that I love about what you’re saying, I have a different way of phrasing a very similar concept. The tagline in my business is be in charge, take action, get results. And one of the things that I also have as a core value is self determination, right? Our absolute superpower as humans is our power to choose.

Erin Marcus: And to take that a step further, a power to create. To your point, create our own path. It’s interesting to me how many people don’t feel that way. Right, they’re waiting for someone else to set a path, they’re waiting for, right, they’re sitting back complaining about what they don’t like, and yet it’s easy to consider them weak or victim y, but truthfully most people don’t know that they have a different option.

Erin Marcus: You know, to be a little more empathetic, I don’t think people realize how much influence you can have over your own journey. So where does somebody And I would be interested in your take on that because there’s you and me, and I think we’re, we’re all surrounded by people who are on, who are in control of their own journey because of who, what we choose to do and for business and, and, and yet there’s, I would say more people don’t realize.

Erin Marcus: that they can have this and do this than people who do realize it.

Rick Yvanovich: I think you’ve, you’ve touched, you’ve touched on it. The, the key thing is that people need to realize that there is always a choice.

Rick Yvanovich: So one can choose to try and shape and control our own destiny and what we’re doing. Or we can choose not to.

Erin Marcus: Is that, okay, so, I can tell by the way you have an accent, you’re not from the United States, and I believe if I’m guessing correctly you’re living in a country you didn’t grow up in, plus you, right, so, and you’re, you’re spending your life all over the world, really. Is it a American problem, or are you seeing this more universally?

Erin Marcus: It’s this mixture of entitlement, right? The things should just be done for me, as well as a lack of realization you have you can take control, is that it seems so prevalent here to me. Are you seeing that elsewhere, or you kind of want to shake a stick at the Americans and say wake up?

Rick Yvanovich: Interesting, interesting question.

Rick Yvanovich: I’d say it’s a universal problem. It’s everywhere. Potentially the way that you see it, you’ll maybe looking through the lens of, Hey, you get it, you’re choosing what to do. You know, this, why doesn’t anyone else in this country get it? Okay. I’ll put that aside because I’m not from the States.

Rick Yvanovich: Don’t understand the States. So I can’t really comment.

Rick Yvanovich: Yes, I’m a Brit. But I, It’s, it’s similar in other countries. So, so where, where’s the problem really coming from? What’s the root cause of the issue? The root cause of the issue is, is maybe in, in the cultures that, that we come from certain cultures, which includes our education system, you know, the sort of factory education system that we all know is out of date dictates the, you know, we follow the curriculum.

Rick Yvanovich: You know, we sit, we sit in our chair and, and we follow the rules.

And

Rick Yvanovich: the rules say, you need to learn this and you need to look at things in a certain way. And, you know, as long as you answer the questions correctly based on what we’ve taught you, you’ll do okay. You know, that’s the, that’s the story, but it doesn’t quite work like that.

Rick Yvanovich: Does it? Because the moment you step out of that classroom, you go out into the real life world, the textbooks are of all disappeared. There is no real curriculum that, you know, the tests are going to be based on whatever is thrown at you so you’re not necessarily going to know the answers, and for a lot of people, that’s rather unsettling and that doesn’t really compute because If we’ve been educated to say, well, you know, we’re going to give you the knowledge that you need to succeed and then you leave school or even go leave university And you’re still not very employable or employers say you’re not very employable because you don’t know how to work And there’s so much that you don’t know It’s it’s It’s all a bit of a challenge, isn’t it?

Rick Yvanovich: So, possibly, the way the things are, they’re not helping us. The system does not seem to be

Erin Marcus: working on our behalf, no.

Rick Yvanovich: Yeah, you know, to adopt the mindset that, yeah, we have a choice. We can say no, we can, you know, choose our direction. We don’t have to conform necessarily. Okay. Whereas there’s still too many systems that are pushing us in a certain direction and it doesn’t fit everyone.

Rick Yvanovich: Okay. And I believe, you know, this is why I’ve adopted this business as unusual. When we look at the great resignation, the great reshuffle, the great Insert whatever word that you want. It’s decisions by people to move, but why are they moving? In some cases because the grass is greener but I think in a lot of cases because Where they are isn’t where they want to be. So I S I see that as sort of positive cause it’s a realization that we’re in the wrong place.

Rick Yvanovich: Okay. Unfortunately, they move somewhere else and that’s not the right place either. And so they move again. And so we keep work, you know, that’s why the great, great reshuffle or the great, whatever you want to call it, hasn’t ended yet because we’re all still trying to work out where should we be. Okay, and and to loop right back to the original question and what we’re talking about is yeah, people have a choice And we need to start making some choices.

Rick Yvanovich: We can’t just wait, you know And I think there was a big movement with the reshuffle or whatever because so many people have been waiting

Erin Marcus: And I think that is the, the danger. I think when I, when I look at the great resignation and I always, I always laugh about it because I didn’t need a social movement to tell me to quit every job I hated.

Erin Marcus: Like if I hated the job, I just didn’t stay there. But to your point, most people, They didn’t know what they wanted instead, right? They were moving away from a painful situation. And the problem with that, in my opinion, so I’d love to get your take on this, if you’re, if you make a move to avoid pain, as opposed to doing something to reach for pleasure, right, reach because you have drive, you will stop the second the pain is alleviated.

Erin Marcus: Because all you’re trying to do is to alleviate the pain, right? Alleviate the discomfort. So, so many people quit their jobs because they hated their situation, but they didn’t have a better alternative. They didn’t have an intended alternative that they were suited for, right? They opened their own businesses, but they didn’t realize this is not grass is always greener.

Erin Marcus: Like, if it were easy, everyone would be doing it, right? So, it was only half the battle. Half the battle is stepping away from what you don’t like. But if you don’t have the coping mechanisms and the knowledge and the drive to create what it is you do want, you’re It’s just a different version of frustration.

Rick Yvanovich: Absolutely. I agree with you. People are leaving or too many people. Because let’s not generalize it. Too many people are leaving for the wrong reasons and they’re leaving because they’re avoiding pain or they don’t like something. They don’t want something. But there are the, it’s the wrong question being asked.

Rick Yvanovich: The question individuals need to ask themselves is what do they want? And have absolute clarity about that. Now, most people can say, You know, when asked the question, they’ll say what they don’t want, but they’re still not saying what they want. So I don’t like this job and my job sucks because of you know, that, okay, you’re not very happy, but what do you want?

Rick Yvanovich: Okay. Otherwise, if you don’t, if you don’t have that clarity, as you said, you’ll jump, you’ll go somewhere else, that pain or whatever has gone away. And like, why am I in this new job? I don’t like this either.

Erin Marcus: Right. It’s the pattern repeats because right. You’re avoiding. You’re not actually solving the underlying problem.

Erin Marcus: And I, it is very true. People, I ask people all the time, what do you want? And they, they either, they can’t answer it or what they give me is a top, especially with small businesses. I’ll be like, what do you want? And they’ll give me a top gross revenue, right? A top line gross revenue, which means absolutely nothing.

Erin Marcus: Without more information, right? There’s a million different versions of a million dollar business. Which one of them do you want?

Even,

Rick Yvanovich: even on that, even on that point, they want to a business that does a million dollars turnover or whatever it does. Is that what they really want? Right. No, that that’s just a measure of the volume of business and that may be the value of business.

Rick Yvanovich: But what do they really want? Question still hasn’t been answered.

Erin Marcus: How much time do you want to spend on things? And I think, I do think exactly like you said, the school system creates good factory workers, that’s what it does, that’s what it did, that’s what it was designed for. But, the challenge of entitlement, when mixed with not knowing what you want, it’s creating a perfect storm.

Erin Marcus: Personally, I just don’t understand how any of these folks are being able to pay their bills. For

Tell

Rick Yvanovich: me

more

Rick Yvanovich: about this, this concept of entitlement.

Erin Marcus: It doesn’t even have to be a negative, it doesn’t even have to be a negative, spoiled brat necessarily connotation. I mean there is that version of it, but the pendulum swings back and forth, right, with Generations.

Erin Marcus: And you have the baby boomers, for example, right? If you really look at it, the greatest generation, our World War Two veterans, they raised a bunch of hippies, right? Nothing could be further from them. And then our, you know, peace, love community, right? They raised a bunch of 80s babies, which we were feral children that went into the, you know, decade of grief, right?

Erin Marcus: So the pendulum swings back and forth. And so then you have my generation, Gen X, who, like I said, raised ourselves. It’s absolutely hysterical. The jokes about it are very funny. And then we turned into a bunch of helicopter parents and raised a bunch of Adults who don’t know how to necessarily do things for themselves because of how much was done for them.

Erin Marcus: So, maybe entitlement in some way is too strong of a word. The, you know, the participation trophy generation. So when you raise a generation who believes you’re always supposed to be happy. And everything is supposed to be fine, and you don’t necessarily have to get over adversity in order to receive. And they don’t know what they want, and the school system was created for good factory workers, which they were told they don’t have to be.

Erin Marcus: You create this little perfect storm

of,

Erin Marcus: you know, how do they get out of this?

Rick Yvanovich: Good point. So, so I see where you’re coming from. At the end of the day, it, it’s really saying the, some people just aren’t aware, aren’t aware, they lack the education, or they, they lack the knowledge, not their fault necessarily. That’s how they were raised whether, whether it’s through society or, you know, their parents or whatever, you know, it is as it is.

Rick Yvanovich: But people, even those, those people who didn’t come up in such an entitled environment they can also still be stuck and still unaware. You know, the fact that people need to learn, need, you know, we need to reemphasize that. Yes, you do have a choice. Yes, you know, you, you, that’s why I say we need to be an architect of change.

Rick Yvanovich: We can’t just react because things are happening around us. And then. Bitch about it because we don’t like what, you know, how we’ve reacted. Well, if you don’t, if you don’t like that, then you have to change what you’re doing and you have to be more proactive and you have to plan exactly where you’re going to go and how you’re going to get there.

Rick Yvanovich: I mean, you know, and if you haven’t tried it, try it. You know, you can’t brush it off if you haven’t given it a go yet. Know, when it comes to this happiness thing, yeah, that, that was a bit misleading to say that we’re supposed to be happy. That was very misleading, wasn’t it? And, and, and just to get the generation straight, I’m a baby boomer, by the way.

Rick Yvanovich: So I have my own lens of looking at things. But so. Link to knowing what you want is also linked to what is the point of view? What is your purpose? What is your life purpose? You know, and I only realized mine in the last five years, which means I realized it rather late. That wasn’t really a problem. I didn’t, I didn’t really, I think, although I didn’t have a life purpose written out and, and I was driving to all the time, which I am today. What I was doing anyway, and what I’ve come up as my current life purpose is what I’ve been doing for decades. It just wasn’t put into words.

Rick Yvanovich: And I feel that it’s more and more important for people Especially if they’re caught in this great reshuffle, and they’re moving here, there and everywhere, searching for something or running away from something doesn’t matter. It’s, it’s, it’s, it’s still a bit like the you know, the Alice in Wonderland where Alice is speaking to the cat and says like, which way shall I go?

Rick Yvanovich: And the cat’s saying, well, where is it you want to go? And Alice says, I don’t know. There’s a really doesn’t matter which way you go then. And, and, and that’s what people are, I feel people are doing. And maybe they don’t even realize that they’re doing that. I mean, you said yourself that maybe they’re making the same mistake again and again.

Rick Yvanovich: I mean, how many times do they need to make that same mistake? before they realize that, hang on, I’m making the same mistake. Wait, wait, feels like I’ve been

Erin Marcus: here before. What? Yes.

Rick Yvanovich: Yeah. You know, so I, I think there needs to be an awakening or a greater awareness. The there is a better way. We do need clarity.

Rick Yvanovich: We do need a direction. We do need to individually make a decision of what it is that we really want. Okay. That has a real meaning that has a real purpose. That is something that we might wish or even want to spend our entire rest of life doing. Okay. If we’ve got that clarity, yeah, then we know where to go and, you know, we can set goals and progress and grow and, and basically be happy.

Erin Marcus: Well, and I do think the thing that I think that is very cool and very amazing is as much as people were not necessarily prepared to do this, there has never been a time for it to have been easier to do this. Right. We live in a world with such access to information with so many opportunities with so many lanes that were never there before, you know, historically people only lived within 10, 15 miles of where they, you know, 30 miles of where they grew up.

Erin Marcus: And now I, I live and work all over the world. And so. Yes, it can be a little overwhelming also when there’s an infinite number of options. It can be a little overwhelming to choose, but I, if you really think about it. There’s never been a time where this type of change has been more possible than right now.

Rick Yvanovich: Absolutely. Totally agree. And again, this is why, you know, I like calling things business as unusual. There’s nothing normal about what’s going on now. It’s all new. And it’s, it’s not going to stop the, the, the pace of change is picking up the, the way that we, I won’t use the word should, the, the way the individuals work is becoming a more individual thing.

Rick Yvanovich: Yes. And there’s no right way. And there’s no wrong way that there’s an infinite number of, of, of, of permutations and we each need to work out what we want.

Erin Marcus: It’s so, you know, it’s one of those things. It’s like, it’s so simple, but it’s not easy, right? It’s so simple. It’s so straightforward. It’s so simple, but it’s not.

Erin Marcus: You know, if it were easy, everyone would be doing it type of thing. I get it. We’re going we’re up against neuroscience. We’re up against society upbringing. We’re up against family history. We’re up against a lot of things. So yes, it’s not always easy, but it really is so simple. And for me, as I’m listening to you, I’m trying to think about like, okay, if there would be one thing, one piece of advice, I’ll give mine and then we’ll give yours.

Erin Marcus: If there would be one piece of advice to give people. One way to behave, to interact with the world, to move towards these options. As I get older, I find that staying curious, As opposed to judgmental like just being open curiosity and open interest in all of it benefits me greatly as opposed to deciding and judging whether something is right or wrong before we’ve even talked about it.

Erin Marcus: Right. But that open curiosity for me has been a really good place to start. Right. Isn’t that interesting. I wonder what’s possible. What would you give as a place for people to start?

Rick Yvanovich: I would agree with the curiosity. We, we, we, we need to learn how to be, be that kid again and, and ask why all the time.

Rick Yvanovich: I mean, you know, it’s, again, testament to our bad upbringing. We, we, we, we condition kids we condition children. They start asking why and, and they’re told to, you know, they’re shut down basically. So that we, we teach them to be not curious, but then we want them to be curious, which doesn’t make a lot of sense.

Rick Yvanovich: And it’s crazy that there, you know, there are even consulting techniques called the five whys, you know, which took some very intelligent people to dream up in big consulting companies to teach us. How to ask the question why when we already know that we were born

Erin Marcus: when it was beat out of us as children.

Erin Marcus: Right. Yeah. I know. So, so

Rick Yvanovich: it, it, it, it doesn’t make sense. So yeah. So be curious, be childlike, you know, bring play. I mean, play, play is fun, right? Play is how we learn. And yet that got thrown away as well. That got taken out of us when, when we became adults. Okay. And, and, and yet what’s been learned during the last few years, the pandemic is the way that we educate people is not very good.

Rick Yvanovich: We have to change it because it’s now all online. It’s very, very different. And and all the studies that I’ve looked at and all the discussions I’ve had is we’ve got to bring play back into it. Well, come on. We knew how to do all of this until we beat it out of people. So yeah, so let’s bring some play and fun back into things because it was fun to work, then maybe we wouldn’t have a lot of problems.

Rick Yvanovich: problems that we’re faced with. But going back to, you know, not just curiosity. The, the thing that I always stick with is Kaizen. I like the word Kaizen, it’s one of my core values. It’s my, my second core value, as I say it. And my interpretation of Kaizen is not just you know, it’s, it’s real Japanese roots, which is a change for good, which is continuous growth.

Rick Yvanovich: Improvement, even tiny, tiny, tiny improvement. I additionally reframe it to be a lifelong learning. So learn something new every single day. If something goes wrong at work or whatever, okay, it means that there was a breakdown in the process that we put together. It’s a fantastic opportunity to fix what was broken, apply a bit of Kaizen.

Rick Yvanovich: Oh, that doesn’t work anymore. All right. So we need to change it to this. Wonderful. What’s the problem? Okay. I also agree with you on the, on the, on the judgment. I’m a very judgmental person but that’s something I’m trying to beat out of myself by trying not to be judgmental anymore. Trying to be more.

Rick Yvanovich: open minded and not just the first part of open minded by seeing other people’s perspectives. I mean, the second part of being open minded is not only seeing other people’s perspectives, but being prepared to change your own perspective. As in, okay, I was wrong then. You know, admit, okay, my perspective was maybe too blinkered and I need to change it.

Rick Yvanovich: You know, I, I, I do that. I have a, in my, in my notebook, I, I have, I don’t know if you can see this. Yeah. Well, you can’t see it. Fake screen. It’s the number six. Okay. So if you put it a number six down and you show it to one person, they will see a six and you show it to another person. They will see a number nine.

Rick Yvanovich: Right. So just show it to two different people. And I said, what do you see? And they see what they see. And it’s not the same. Okay. It’s just showing that it’s a different perspective of the same thing. Okay, so I want to be really difficult. It’s neither a six nor a nine. It’s actually a, a, a pencil marking on a piece of paper.

Rick Yvanovich: There’s another way of looking at it. That’s a third way of looking exactly the same thing. So these are different perspectives of the same thing. And it really, really helps to look at the same situation differently. And we need to do that. We need to do that in order to, to, to learn different perspectives and also to adopt that mindset of not being judgmental.

Erin Marcus: Absolutely. The way that I described that perspective. concept is you and I could go to the scariest horror movie ever made and we can sit next to each other and watch that same movie and you could have the absolute time of your life and I could end up needing therapy. The movie didn’t change, right? It was our perspectives of that movie that produced our realities and It’s so easy not to go in a completely left turn here, but when someone has strong personalities.

Erin Marcus: And I, I, you know, if I do my personality profiles, I come out very strong in some places. And that’s just like it. It’s. we have to work to not be judgmental on the other perspectives. It’s just, right, staying curious. I always go back to staying curious. Isn’t that interesting that I thought that horror movie was the worst thing I’ve ever done and someone else thought it was great.

Erin Marcus: Isn’t that interesting? And why are they so weird? Right? Like, but staying curious about all of it.

Right .

Erin Marcus: Absolutely. So if people wanna continue this conversation with you and learn more about it and grab a copy of your book for sure and learn how can they, I call it being in charge. How can they have business as unusual?

Erin Marcus: And I’m such a big fan of pa, your own path. What is the best way for them to find you, get ahold of you, interact with you, all of the things.

Rick Yvanovich: Good question. So, listeners who are interested in continuing a conversation with me, learning, maybe learning more about me, or exploring more of the insights from, from my journey, the best way to connect with me is to go to my website.

Rick Yvanovich: And my website is my name, rickivanovich. com. If you don’t want to go there the other place you’ll find me on social media is on LinkedIn. Okay. I’m very, very active there and all you need to do is do a search for my name, Rick Ivanovich. It’s a very unique name and I believe there is only one person on this planet and you’re looking at them with this name.

Rick Yvanovich: Okay. Google it. Seriously. Just Google my name. You were the number

Erin Marcus: one. Yeah. No,

Rick Yvanovich: it’s the only one. There is no other person on the planet with that name, which is really quite unusual. Yes.

Erin Marcus: I I have. a doctor for years and there’s another Aaron Marcus that goes to that doctor and I get very excited when I go because they’re forever grabbing the wrong chart but I consider it a compliment because the other Aaron Marcus is 15 years younger than me so I figure if they keep grabbing the wrong chart I must look okay

for my age.

Erin Marcus: So we will make sure that we have all of these links and make it really easy. Put them in the show notes so that people can want, you know, you’re just one click away from everybody, but thank you for your time. And I know in your part of the world, it is well past your bedtime. So thank you for staying awake and spending time with me today.

Erin Marcus: And I love your perspective and your different takes on a similar journey. I think the more people need to land differently and more people hear it Because it’s absolutely one of my core values as well. So thank you. Thank you for joining me

Rick Yvanovich: Well, thank you very much erin, you know, I want to leave everyone with the final thought.

Rick Yvanovich: Yes Just remember everyone who’s listening. We are not just a participant in this ever changing world, but we are architects shaping the course of our lives, our careers, and the world and the environment around us. So I encourage each and every single one of you to embrace change and define it. Rather than just adapt and react to it, be that catalyst in your own business as unusual world.

Rick Yvanovich: And the transformation starts with you. And I’m really eager to hear more about your journeys. So please reach out to me. As Erin said, they’ll be in the show notes. Awesome. Okay, Erin, I’d like to express my gratitude for For for letting me on your podcast today and and and sharing some of my thoughts.

Rick Yvanovich: It’s been a fun and a fascinating conversation and I hope your listeners have enjoyed it as much as I have. Absolutely. And to all. All the folks listening, I really appreciate your time and attention. I really look forward to hearing from some of you and learning from your experiences, your journeys, your perspectives, and sharing more in depth future discussions.

Rick Yvanovich: So thank you again, Erin, and to all our listeners for this wonderful exchange. Hope to see you again next time.

Erin Marcus: Thank you. Thank you.

Erin Marcus: I hope you enjoyed this episode of the ready yet podcast. I truly enjoy bringing these stories of success and inspiration to you. Please join us in our mission to empower entrepreneurs to be in charge of their businesses and in charge of their lives by sharing this with anyone you know, who would benefit from our tactical and motivating advice, leaving us a review and letting us know if there are any particular topics you would really appreciate hearing about.

Erin Marcus: See you next time.

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